1. Conor Grant

2. Matt Palmer

Over the years, likes of Duffield, Boland, Chillingworth, Hackworthless

It's true that Matt Palmer has only scored four goals for Notts in 137 games, but Matt's worth is elsewhere on the field of play.

He's certainly getting back to the player we saw under Luke Williams, being Notts's Mr reliability in the centre of Midfield. He's an important player for Notts because he's very good at driving the team forward & orchestrating attacks. He's the Club Captain too.

I think that Conor Grant may miss a few goal scoring opportunities, but a player has to get into good positions to get those opportunities.

I think Conor is a good squad player with useful attributes. He's only 24 so he can still improve.

I think at this particular time Hall is in front of him in the current SM pecking order & maybe Luker too. Iorpenda is also playing as an AM. So Conor has some stiff competition.

Like Martin Allen was talking about on Magpie Circle a few weeks ago, there's a lot of value in working backwards from the stats you need to be a champion or promotion contender. Total goals required bears itself out in most leagues, most seasons. So players who will only chip in 4 or 5 a season from key attacking positions just won't cut it.

Hall has 4 in 4, looks like such a cool, natural finisher and assister.

There's no point looking good, you actually have to do the business.

Palmer and Norburn was a problem. Robbo will chip in with a few goals and assists, but his presence and impact in the attacking third will also create opportunities for others. In this case, I'd say it's possible to win promotion if MP goes P46 goals 0. But if we have a No10 going P46 goals 4, we can't.

I think Matt Palmer is getting close to the player he was when he was getting the plaudits from PON members re this article in May 2023

As long as strikers are scoring we don’t have a problem but it’s good when midfielders can chip in with a few goals too, who remembers Richard Butchers scoring run?

As Robbie says Palmers skills are elsewhere but I do think Grant badly needs one of his many golden opportunities to go in to give him some confidence. Hall is doing brilliantly at the moment and I’m sure he’ll score many more.

It appears to be the case that Palmer and Grant don't have what it takes to score. I remember Matt Palmer's goal against Wealdstone, when we beat them 6-1 at their place. He didn't quite know how to celebrate when he scored, no doubt due the fact he doesn't do it very often. Grant has the opportunities, but it seems his personality lacks that ruthless streak to finish clinically.

Kicking the ball into the net is the hardest thing to do in football. If Grant were ever to overcome the mental block that stops him doing it (unless he doesn't have to think about it) then he'd be a pretty valuable player. Paterson obviously sees something in Grant to persevere with him, even though you might not think he's Patto's type, i.e. not got the killer instinct. It would be fantastic if he could fix it, that rare thing, a coach making someone a better player.

If Palmer scored 10+ goals a season, he wouldn’t be in League 2 as he’d be the perfect midfielder. He’s been a lot more pro-active and finds himself more advanced than usual compared to last so I think we’ll get a Palmer goal this season.

Grant seems to be able to do everything right and then it gets to moment he has to shoot, if he can change that he should be able to get a decent number of goals because he’s got the knack of getting into good goal-scoring positions. But yes right now scoring looks like the most difficult thing in the world for him.

If Palmer scores it's a big bonus. Palmer's skill is as an initiator of Notts forward movement.

martin paterson said when he arrived that he wanted his players to be used in the right way and that they need to be played to their strengths and not asked to do something that is outside of their skill set.

without matt palmer in this notts squad, we would be lost much like we were in our first season back when he got injured.

palmer plays such an important role that it helps to get the best out of other players. he makes everything seem so simple, but hes not a natural goalscorer. hes a provider and a creative midfielder who is the link in our chain. scott robertson flourishes alongside palmer, take palmer out of the squad a lot of players do not seem the same. john bostock suffered from this, and he ended up being released because he just was not the same player as he could be alongside our skipper.

a lot of people are harsh on players, especially conor grant. he works so hard on the ball and can make things happen, he just does not seem to be a natural goalscorer but i think he could improve given the chance. whereas i think palmer is set in his ways and we are fortunate to have him in our team.

He is a quiet player who lets his control and creativity show his quality. Some players can score goals but offer little else. Enzio Boldewijn is an example of that. Hard work and consistency should be valued just as much as goals.

Matt Palmer might need to be a little more selfish when he has the ball. It could also be that his passing is stronger than his shooting. Conor Grant is a good player. He can be frustrating at times, but he helps us keep the ball and move forward.

He is dangerous when opening up play. It could help him to work on shooting drills and to take fewer touches when he has a chance to score.

A lot of our players are not the most reliable finishers. Kellan Gordon and Nick Tsaroulla have both missed very good chances and do not often take the ones that come their way. The same could be said about Scott Robertson, Ollie Norburn and Tom Iorpenda.

It is not only Conor Grant or Matt Palmer who struggle in this area. Players like Jodi Jones make up for it with assists and creativity. Jodi is more than capable of scoring but does not. I do not think people hold it against him, as he works hard and is a real asset to the squad.

Palmer is a credit to Notts and Grant also puts in the effort. Grant might benefit from an extra push from Martin Paterson, perhaps by being challenged to score more.

Mai Traore should not be given a free pass just because he has not settled. He is a professional footballer and so far looks like the biggest flop of the Reedtz era. I would love to see him celebrate a goal, but he needs to show more form and play at a better level.

Every player has limits, but each brings something different to the squad. As long as we have players who can finish chances, the goals will come. We are fortunate to have Alassana Jatta and even Matthew Dennis to a degree.

I do not want anyone to take my comment the wrong way, and I am directing this to the fans outside of this site.

There are people who have never played professional football, yet they pick out a player and single him out. They turn dislike into a crude witch hunt. This is what is happening to Conor Grant.

There is a reason why he is playing for us, and why MK Dons did not want him. I believe he is a good player, very gifted with the ball at his feet, but his finishing is a weaker part of his game.

Consistency can also be an issue. He reminds me of an unpolished player, but one with higher potential, in the mould of Sam Austin.

I wrote on here a few weeks back @sentient that Conor Grant was a prime candidate for a short loan to the NL. He's 24, but maybe a young 24, who hasn't reached his peak yet. He needs to know what it feels like to be a potent player that can produce on a consistent basis. So I think the loan Hinchy got would've been more suitable for Conor.

Wiki has his career stats at P161 G15. A goal every 11 games is just not going to cut it for us. If that player is a regular in an attacking position, you are not going to be promoted. It's no good saying the goals will come from somewhere else. I don't go on social media so I don't know about 'a witch hunt'. Trump has probably destroyed the meaning of that phrase, but anyway, I can imagine it not being very nice and going too far. He's our player thru til summer 2027, and he'll still only be 25 at that time. I really hope he can realise more of his potential by then

I think the harshness some players receive can be a major hindrance to their performance.

Some players want to prove themselves, such as Jodi Jones, but others just quietly get on with things. I do wonder if Conor Grant has read any of the messages about how some fans think of him? You wouldn't think he was all that well-liked, a natural, and again, players who deserve such stick never seem to get it. We are talking about the likes of Richard Duffy, who would be blindly defended for making constant mistakes and passing short balls back.

Not every player needs to score; they just have to be better in other areas, and the way I see it, you build a team at this level based on what makes you stronger. If we had 10 outfield players who could score regularly, then we would be losing them far more often, as it would suggest League Two wasn't their level.

There are Championship teams who have midfields outscored by their defence come the end of the season.

Conor Grant does take too many touches, and I think he overthinks when shooting. This sounds like confidence, but we know Grant can score. Being a midfielder, even an attacking-minded one, doesn't guarantee goals. There have been exceptional wingers who thrive on assisting; Palace had a player a few seasons ago who missed some sitters during a game I watched.

Yet his crossing was dangerous and very exciting to watch, as they were pinpoint and very well placed.

Grant has scored the same amount of goals as Palmer, but in considerably fewer appearances; the two players are different. I hope Grant can improve, because he is a smart footballer.

I'd look at it this way.... MP seems very settled on the 3-4-2-1 formation...

We don't have defenders who score.

Palmer and Robbo are not scorers

Our wing-backs will get a few, but are not regular scorers

The 2 in that 3-4-2-1, absolutely have to score. That's 92 appearances between the 2 positions. If we're to have any chance of promotion at all we have to get at least 25 goals from those positions. Maybe more. Hall is on his way, but we really can't have a non-scoring 4 or 5 goal contributor in that other position IMO

It is interesting that as @theAnticlough says we don’t have defenders that score and in particular central defenders. Is it due to poor corner taking, dominant opposition defending in the box or is it that just about every other team in league two has a goalkeeper that comes for crosses. I wonder…..

I don't think it's a massive deal @McPie but it sure is a bonus for a promotion aspiring teams, if we remember the Munto & Warnock teams for example.

Bedeau and Macari just seem to lose their heads when they get near goal. Platt can score, not sure about RodMac. Aljofree got off to a good start but issues at the other head caught up. I think we can predict some low level chipping in from the back, Macari and Bedeau will probably get over their panic and notch a couple each. But if they do, we can't have that being a half or a third of the No10 totals.

We have already seen the attacking midfield players chipping in with assists & goals.

Iorpenda: 3 assists

Luker: 3 assists, 1 goal

Hall: 1 assist, 3 goals

Jones: 1 assist, 1 goal

Grant: 1 goal

Matt Palmer has chipped in with 2 assists,

Robertson: 1 goal

Tsaroulla has 1 assist & 2 goals

So players all around the team are chipping in with assists & goals. I think Iorpenda, Luker & Hall will become the lynchpin of the AM area.

If they can chip in over the next 75% of the season they should all have an impressive tally of assists & goals

11 minutes ago, Robbie said:

We have already seen the attacking midfield players chipping in with assists & goals.

Iorpenda: 3 assists, 1 goal

Luker: 3 assists, 1 goal

Hall: 1 assist, 3 goals

Hall has 4 goals.

In the 11 games Iorpenda's played, which one did he score in @Robbie ?

@theAnticlough I've only included league goals and assists.

And your right, Iorpenda hasn't scored any league goals yet, my mistake, misreading my info. Thanks for pointing it out.

Iorpenda hasn't got any league goals, any other goals this season....or any senior goal...ever....for anybody

Yes, he's a prospect - but what makes people think he can be a major contributor to a L2 promotion aspiring club?

[The answer is how certain fans are very taken with 'big' players...oooh he's tall, he's physical, 'ooh, isn't he big' (having a bit of fun here) and not what he's capable of doing with the ball].

I think Gagliardi had 2 shots at landing 1 player with Iorpenda and Luker, maybe Montague would've taken neither knowing the demands and the target better - concentrating more on calibre of players like Abbott (a Montague recruit) and Hall.

We need to remember that a quarter of the season is gone and we're mid-table for a reason having lost 4 games already. We are on track to finish outside the play-offs and way short of autos. Work still needs to be done to find a winning formula and that means forcing equalisers at places like Gillingham, getting winners against Walsall, Salford, Crewe, MK etc. IMO, the projected output of our current No10s won't get us there if, one of those shirts is Iorpenda's.

I guess with loanees, loaning clubs have to understand that professional teams taking the players are not forced to play them if it's impacting on results.

I think that Notts have been fortunate to get the services of Iorpenda, Luker & Hall on loan. They are very good young prospects & I'm sure they are going to have very good football careers.

There is no doubt that team performance is improving & I'm sure those three players are going to have a big part to play during the rest of the season.

Martin Paterson seems to have confidence in their abilities.

I'm excited about Hall. Luker has been very promising and productive in the limited pitch time he's had. Pity he got injured just as he was getting going.

This is specifically about Iorpenda for me. How can we possibly pin our hopes on a young prospect who has never scored a senior goal? And only made a handful of appearances, half at Hyde United in the NPL.

He's done OK, put in some good performances. I even voted him my MoM as recently as 4 or 5 games ago. So there's definitely something there. But there's been a drop off since then and it's the fact he's occupying a key attacking position but looks miles away from ever being to score. I know it will cost us.

I'd like to see Dennis, Jarvis and Luker tried there over the next few games, partnering Hall. I think Montague and the club needs to see all the options there, before knowing what needs to be done in January.

The formation does help push certain players into more advanced areas, which can be useful. But it's the individual qualities of each player that really make the attack work. Everyone plays a part, and when the midfield isn't quite clicking, the forwards often find it harder to make an impact.

Rather than pointing fingers at players for not scoring, it might be better to look at how we can help them get into good positions. If they aren't getting chances, it's not just down to them. Wing backs can be key here, either by cutting inside or linking up quickly with others to create space.

Corners are one area where Notts could improve. The same goes for free kicks. We do have players who can score from set pieces, but how often do we try something different, like floating the ball in with a bit of finesse? It feels like there's room to be more creative.

I wouldn't be too concerned about Conor Grant. He brings a lot to the team. Matt Palmer might not be someone you'd expect to score, but he's a solid midfielder who works hard and keeps things ticking over.