Goodbye Stanley and Thank You

[Piethagoram]

@NewNottsFan Always good to have your input from north of the border. JF certainly didn't do anything to help himself in the media stakes. Valencic scored a humdinger in JF's maybe first game, only to be dropped without any explanation. JF needed to be more streetwise and perhaps say, well you better ask Stan directly why he isn't playing? I don't buy into "protecting the players"... Something needed to be said and it wasn't. The whole saga got out of hand, no wonder the Supporters sided with Stan, as JF's post match interviews showed no respect to the Supporters into any analysis of what had been witnessed... It was a never ending record of "back to the training field"

[Chris]

Brilliant exchange between @NewNottsFan and @Piethagoram (who's mentioned what I was going to add).

Aborah is one of them the right manager will understand how to get the most out of, Ian McParland recently told me a story about Neal Bishop (nothing negative). However he mentioned that players have their roles, he did also mention earlier that Aborah is the type of player who gets people sacked. I suppose to a sense it's true, however this would highlight weak management in my opinion or at least an inability to work with strong minded or just plain awkward players.

He wants to play, simple as that - I'm not sure why there's been comments about him refusing to play (not seen that anywhere).

A manager selects the players who will do what they want or feel they will carry out their instructions to their best ability - Shaun Derry made it clear he would rid Notts of these types (before Aborah) and I said back then he would have to learn to work with 'em. The same can be applied to Jamie Fullarton and John Sheridan. If JF only uses players that respects him or looks up to him as a manager (not to be personal) - yet I doubt they'd be any good regardless.

It's best since he hasn't featured much that he leaves, yet we as a club will have to find and make use of players who aren't easy to manage.

Payet seemed very disrespectful to West Ham but he wanted out, I'm not sure Aborah wanted out of Notts or if he had of been playing. Could he have helped more this season? I don't know but I stand my ground about thinking he would be better with more quality around him.

[NewNottsFan]

5 hours ago, notts-joe said:

Brilliant exchange between @NewNottsFan and @Piethagoram (who's mentioned what I was going to add).

Aborah is one of them the right manager will understand how to get the most out of, Ian McParland recently told me a story about Neal Bishop (nothing negative). However he mentioned that players have their roles, he did also mention earlier that Aborah is the type of player who gets people sacked. I suppose to a sense it's true, however this would highlight weak management in my opinion or at least an inability to work with strong minded or just plain awkward players.

He wants to play, simple as that - I'm not sure why there's been comments about him refusing to play (not seen that anywhere).

A manager selects the players who will do what they want or feel they will carry out their instructions to their best ability - Shaun Derry made it clear he would rid Notts of these types (before Aborah) and I said back then he would have to learn to work with 'em. The same can be applied to Jamie Fullarton and John Sheridan. If JF only uses players that respects him or looks up to him as a manager (not to be personal) - yet I doubt they'd be any good regardless.

It's best since he hasn't featured much that he leaves, yet we as a club will have to find and make use of players who aren't easy to manage.

Payet seemed very disrespectful to West Ham but he wanted out, I'm not sure Aborah wanted out of Notts or if he had of been playing. Could he have helped more this season? I don't know but I stand my ground about thinking he would be better with more quality around him.

I would hope that a manger can get something out of Aborah as its never good to see any professional wasting ability, however, its clear to see that all managers at ML since Moniz have found his attitude lacking or he , if his ability isn't in question, would have started on a regular basis ...it really is that simple.

The fact remains that he has made limited starts at every club he has been at , not just Notts, and that tells a story of a player who wont put a shift in or has other issues.

I'm a fan and I'll take someone with limited ability who will run through a wall for me rather than a talent who will turn up when it suits them.

Football fans pay to get entertained.... but they also want to see players who care about the club they love and will give as much as effort as the fans would if they got the opportunity to pull their clubs strip on themselves.

Every player has a chance to make the most of what gifts, fitness, attitude, charisma, strength they have ...Aborah unfortunately didn't make the most of his which is a shame but there is light on the horizon for Notts right now, no point looking back ...its the players at ML who need support now , not ones who didn't contribute during the tough times

[Fozzy]

No doubt in my mind that he was the most skillful player at Notts and Moniz used him in a way to get the most out of him. I remember the way he was running the show against Plymouth (even though we were behind) until he got dropped into the back four late on.

I look at him now and think that we did not have (recruit) the players around him in order to get the best out of him under subsequent managers. It showed up his unwillingness to track back, which left massive holes in the midfield and also that he wasn't direct, or willing (able) to release the ball quick enough.

I love ball carrying midfielders who are direct and forward thinking, he wasn't that for me. I have no doubt though that he would have done very well in Keith Curle's side as he would have been a massive upgrade on Boucaud and he would have had Bishop in the same side to do the donkey work.

 

[Elite_pie]

This is Nolan's summary of the situation:

New boss Nolan revealed he had seen enough of Aborah in the three weeks he has been in charge to know that it was not going to work out.  "Stanley has been here for a long time, if you look at his record, he hasn't had a great deal of games before I came in.  He has fluttered about a lot of clubs in a lot of years.  If I am being honest, I thought his training and the way he carries himself didn't suit me as a man.  For me it was better that Stan and I parted ways.  He's a lovely fella, but there were numerous opportunities when I asked a bit more from him and I just feel he didn't take it on board.  He wasn't someone I wanted to continue to work with”.

All very polite on the face of it, but in reality a pretty damning analysis on the character (or lack of it) of Stanley Aborah.  It doesn't take much reading between the lines to realise he's really saying "Aborah is a misfit who refuses to give 100%.  That's why he never lasts very long anywhere."  Exactly what I've been saying for several months now.  Does this make any of his fan club have a bit of a re-think?

 

 

[Northants Pie]

15 hours ago, Elite_pie said:

This is Nolan's summary of the situation:

New boss Nolan revealed he had seen enough of Aborah in the three weeks he has been in charge to know that it was not going to work out.  "Stanley has been here for a long time, if you look at his record, he hasn't had a great deal of games before I came in.  He has fluttered about a lot of clubs in a lot of years.  If I am being honest, I thought his training and the way he carries himself didn't suit me as a man.  For me it was better that Stan and I parted ways.  He's a lovely fella, but there were numerous opportunities when I asked a bit more from him and I just feel he didn't take it on board.  He wasn't someone I wanted to continue to work with”.

All very polite on the face of it, but in reality a pretty damning analysis on the character (or lack of it) of Stanley Aborah.  It doesn't take much reading between the lines to realise he's really saying "Aborah is a misfit who refuses to give 100%.  That's why he never lasts very long anywhere."  Exactly what I've been saying for several months now.  Does this make any of his fan club have a bit of a re-think?

 

 

Tbh in a way yes, it just seems strange though that Moniz (and to a point Mark Cooper) was able to get the best out of him and no one else can. 

So do you agree that its not his ability its his personality that is lacking?

[Piethagoram]

@Northants Pie @Elite_pie Good points by Northants. Even as a paid up member of the #StanleyIn club, I accept it is best to part company..A player whose true potential remained unfulfilled...which I agree with Elite, it is probably down to himself. He was obviously one of Sheridan's 5 that were told to look elsewhere (perm other 4 from Burke, Atkinson, Hewitt....?). I dont think Nolan could have persuaded him to stay as mentally he had finished with Notts. Both Moniz and Copper knew how to handle. In terms of talking about his assists / dead balls...just how many chances did he have..when other players monopolised those situations. 

Its time to move on, and still wish him well

[Elite_pie]

1 hour ago, Northants Pie said:

So do you agree that its not his ability its his personality that is lacking?

In the main yes.  His skill on the ball and close control in a tight situation were probably better than any Notts player I've seen in recent years, but it was mainly artistic rather than productive.  It was great to watch, but very rarely led to a chance on goal.  I'll admit to preferring 100% effort over skill, we are in the basement division so I can tolerate players with limited ability, but I can't tolerate lack of effort and application.  It will be interesting to see where Stan goes next, but I don't think he's cut out for the rough and tumble of lower league English football.

[liampie]

3 hours ago, Elite_pie said:

It was great to watch, but very rarely led to a chance on goal.

problem is its not just aborah but most of the players who fail to create chances, yet sa would often release the ball to players capable of assisting others. he may not have lead to many goals himself but we looked better with him under managers who could use him.

3 hours ago, Elite_pie said:

I'll admit to preferring 100% effort over skill, we are in the basement division so I can tolerate players with limited ability, but I can't tolerate lack of effort and application.

fair point, we dont have the luxury of having any player that goes missing. we need all plans to be hands on and if aborah cannot apply effort or the right mindset.

[Piethagoram]

People talk about effort...citing Campbell as an example, yet the countless time he gives away possession, he never gets the criticism that Stanley got. How Burke is still at the club perhaps sums up his marketability to other clubs

[Elite_pie]

An interesting article (for once) from Leigh Curtis:

 

http://www.nottinghampost.com/the-tragic-case-of-stanley-aborah-s-wasted-talent-at-notts-county/story-30117238-detail/story.html

[Piethagoram]

@Elite_pie I think the article would have more substance if we knew km covered by Stanley versus other midfielders. What the article fails to address is the hopeless home form in the whole of 2016 without Stanley in the side..coincidence? Creativity gives the competitive edge so I do disagree with Elite that players with effort should always be in the team. I give you Adam Campbell, game set and match to me

 

[Elite_pie]

50 minutes ago, Piethagoram said:

@Elite_pie I think the article would have more substance if we knew km covered by Stanley versus other midfielders.

That's the stat I would really love to see.  I'm sure it's available to the fitness coaches at the club, so draw your own conclusions.

[Riverleeno]

I wondered where the rest of the midfield was when Aborah was playing, as he often didn't seem to have anyone to pass to. I realise now he was selfishly holding on to the ball, whilst Rodman pointed into space and O'Connor was adjusting his Captain's armband.

The quality of County's midfield meant we didn't miss him at all. Team players with quality and the right attitude to give 100% effort meant we went on an extended winning streak. 

Sarcasm ends.

As @Piethagoram says time to move on. 

 

[Piethagoram]

@Elite_pie I see on the other board Elite preferred Paul Bolland to Stan. Ye gods, what has the world according to Elite has come too😂

[Elite_pie]

3 minutes ago, Piethagoram said:

@Elite_pie I see on the other board Elite preferred Paul Bolland to Stan. Ye gods, what has the world according to Elite has come too😂

I posted "Of the two, Bolland for me every day of the week - he was completely useless but at least gave everything he had in every game he played. If your preference is for someone who does a fancy pirouette on the half way line, then lets the opposition stroll past unchallenged, I suspect Aborah would be your choice. Because of the level we operate at I can tolerate lack of ability, but even in the basement there is no excuse for lack of effort."   Words I stand by 100%.  Your continuing love affair with Stan is quite touching and your devotion unquestionable, but I'll leave you with another of my posts on the subject - "Everyone is welcome to their opinion, but I would just remind you that mine seems to have been shared by quite a few in charge at Notts, who all worked with him closely. I'll ask his fan club yet again - why has "the best midfielder outside the Championship" not been snapped up by any of our rivals?"

[NottsGeezerCal]

Aborah wanted to leave under JF but the only team that wanted him was York City..

On his day he was a good player but he's day didn't come about enough..

[Piethagoram]

@Elite_pie let's look at some facts:

Notts with Stan, average 1.24 pts per game,

Notts without Stan, average 0.88 pts per game

So 40 per cent improvement with Stan in the team. No amount of "effort" which Elite values so much, cannot make up for the "quality" missing! 😉

[Elite_pie]

As I've said elsewhere, could we have the 'facts' on points with and without Alex Rodman in the team?

[Elite_pie]

Here you go Piethagoram, I've done the Rodman stats myself, and they surprised even me. Alex Rodman has played in 16 games this season (22 pts), and been absent for 13 games (4 pts). This is the average points per game ratio with and without him:

Notts with Alex Rodman playing - average 1.375 points per game.
Notts without Alex Rodman playing - average 0.308 points per game.

I make that a 446% improvement with Rodman which means that he was over 11 times more influential than Aborah! I think both were substandard players, but it shows that stats don't always tell the full story.  You can't have it both ways.
 

[Piethagoram]

Perhaps Rodman and Stanley together would be a partnership that would work. Much as I respect @Elite_pie postings, his preference for a Bolland over Stan, begs the question is Bedlem still open😂

[Elite_pie]

2 hours ago, Piethagoram said:

Perhaps Rodman and Stanley together would be a partnership that would work. Much as I respect @Elite_pie postings, his preference for a Bolland over Stan, begs the question is Bedlem still open😂

I think Nolan's words make it pretty clear that Stanley doesn't do partnerships.  He prefers to showboat while the rest do the grafting.

[Piethagoram]

Prefer this Carlsberg analogy

Probably the most skilful midfielder at Meadow Lane in recent times.

Never showboating in a million years Elite. 

[Elite_pie]

30 minutes ago, Piethagoram said:

Prefer this Carlsberg analogy

Probably the most skilful midfielder at Meadow Lane in recent times.

Never showboating in a million years Elite. 

What about the lack of grafting then?

[Piethagoram]

when Stan first arrived, he seemed to get a yellow card every other game. Getting stuck in, was not an issue. Graft, comes in all forms