Thoughts on last nights defence

[Piethagoram]

 

[menzinho]

The annoying thing is when opposition teams actually put an attacking move together the defending in general play isn’t that bad, we can cope on the whole. Yes we occasionally leave a man free or miss a tackle but but I’d say those type of errors are the same for most teams in this league.

What really is hurting us is the decision making from our defenders and that’s costing us goals from seemingly unthreatening and defendable scenarios. All of yesterday's goals were avoidable. It's not like recently teams have been this unstoppable force who can play through us, we just keep giving the opposition the ball!

[liampie]

i am a bit fed up of all the claims that we need new defenders and that our tactics dont need to be changed, whilst i get that signing better defenders would be ideal, i dont think its that practical. we have a good set of defenders who just lose their heads and make poor decisions at times which unfortunately prove to be costly. i think kyle cameron and aden baldwin are two players who can become better if they were paired with someone more strong minded when it comes to defending.

if we could find a no nonsense type defender that is good at organising and defending under pressure it would make a huge difference.

tactically, i do think we need to be smarter when out of possession and ensure players are instructed to get back. it might be worth trying to keep two defenders back at all times and make sure they are supported when needed. the high defensive line invites teams to play balls over the top, so this needs to be focused on in training. i think luke williams needs to work one on one with each defender and get them running drills recreating the errors. the issue is how quickly they need to react and that causes the errors. if we can train in these scenarios and help with confidence it would make a difference.

we cant simply go out and buy a new set of defenders every time we encounter something that can be tactically addressed and worked on in training.

we are a very offensive minded team but i see no reason why we cant defend at the same time.

[Chris]

It's truly remarkable how swiftly things can turn around in football.

Notts has gone from a free-falling circus, with owners who put our club into the headlines for negative and financial reasons. We were so close to the brink of extinction due to those past errors and misguided leadership. To a well-managed club, with owners investing in the squad and club. A manager who is still learning but doing great with passionate players who care about Notts, even if they're not the best in the world. Yet they are ours, they give and make memories through their efforts.

I would rather have this discussion about defensive mistakes, then to see any of the struggles prior to the Reedtz takeover of Notts County.

@menzinho and @liampie make some interesting and superb points.

We as fans are deeply invested in the club and only want to see it succeed, but this doesn't mean we have to turn on our existing players and say well we need to get rid and sign a brand new defensive line.

Even the top teams in the Premier League usually don't go to this extreme.

Coaching is a very valid point to be made - we can coach the players in defensive strategies, how to deal with threats and cope under pressure. This is an area that will take time, but the results would see a more cohesive defence. 

Tactically - we do leave ourselves very vulnerable at the back because we play so high. This is one of the areas where we may see instant improvements, but it may come at a cost of impacting the overall team performance. Ideally, we would instruct the defence to move inline with how the games are advancing, allowing them to drop back in an organised fashion and with teammates coming to fill the open spaces.

The issue is currently, we aren't very well-organised and that leads to defensive mistakes, along with being flustered.

I would like to see more urgency with just clearing the ball away from danger, allowing us to reorganise. I think defensively we should worry so much about playing the ball on the floor, we have players who can press and win it back if we really must lump it forward. This tends to be one of our biggest issues, because we don't lump it forward when the timing is best. We try to make a pass and keep it on the floor, leading to mistakes.

We also have the issue of overthinking and blindly making decisions. This is why it's usually better to keep things simple: we are over doing it when we try to head the ball to one of our players when in a position to bring it down or just kick it out further up for a throw-in. Which would give us some chance to reorganise and take away the stress.

Notts doesn't cope with pressure defensively very well.

I agree that we ideally need a strong centre back bringing in to the club and, I have said for ages, someone in the mould of Mike Edwards would be ideal.

[JIMBO]

Teams that apply pressure and have a certain style of play can expose our defence’s weaknesses. Our defence isn’t perfect and some goals are unavoidable, but what we can defend is the character of our team members. They’re here for the right reasons, they care and want to succeed. So, when criticising them, be a bit more considerate as many will already be disparaging them on social media.

[Countyman]

One mistake might have us discussing different points, two would still be frustrating but three just shows how costly our defence can be to our game. It’s not fair to solely blame the centre backs, as they need support from players further up and sometimes it’s the midfield or wing backs that fail to make the right decision. This doesn’t detract from the need to expect better from the three main defenders.

[cheeky~k8]

The defense is the main issue with notts recently, we need to try to stop some of the mistakes that come with high pressure games and focus on the game and our own defense but its easier said than done sometimes.

[Ohh Tommy Johnson]

Our defence is not just the defenders. Macca runs his legs off closing down early, Palmer tracks(ed) back closing stuff down etc. When this doesn't work so well the back 3 come under more pressure.  We see this with Palmer missing.  I don't think we have anyone that plays the same way which shields the back line.  That said, I think we lack a 'voice' at the back.  None of our defensive unit options is a commanding character, I know it's noisy these days, but one of my memories form my early days at the Lane was the amount of shouting between players that went on.  It seems very quiet these days in comparison.  You could always hear Stubbs, Kilkline, McVay, Avromovic, Brown, McManus, Cherry, Short or Yates shouting to each other... or maybe they did in my imagination, but that was because they were big characters. Turner was a good organiser too.  Someone needs to take that responsibility on, be it Slocombe or Stone or one of the CBs.  We make poor decisions, especially when under pressure, so maybe one quick fix is to give one of the defensive unit that explicit responsibility - organise and manage the others and the defensive midfielders.  Maybe that should be a key characteristic of any new defender we look at.  It just strikes me that there is no clarity in what is expected and when.  As a result our players try to play the ball at all costs even when their instinct is to get rid, resulting in sloppy passes, losing the ball in easy challenges etc. 

One other thing I think is missing is being able to quickly transition from attack to defence,  Sometimes it seems to take a few moments to re-orientate to set up or cover the defence.  We got away with it last year, but at this level, that gets punished, and, as Shrewsbury showed, at the next level it will get punished ruthlessly.  

Anyway I'm rambling...

[RetroPie]

Seeing the goals conceded was dreadful. I’m not sure what causes it and it would be presumptuous of me to try to explain how it could be fixed as I simply don’t know. Adopting a basic approach to defending seems sensible, and I hope Luke Williams can start to address it.

[super_ram]

|I think you have  the answer more or less spot on @Ohh Tommy Johnsonand I agree with you sentiments too, @RetroPie. Sometimes when a Notts attack breaks down defensive players get caught out of position and panic sets in because the defensive structure has been upset.Vocally commanding teammates need to  organise the defence whilst an attack is still ongoing in readiness for any counterattack.Players need to make themselves available with off the ball movement to help give any player put under pressure a way to pass out but keep possession.Failing all this ,giving the ball a good ,old fashioned boot as far away from the danger area as possible is probably sometimes a better option than trying to play the ball out of defence. In the end it all comes back to making the best decision in a split second. All very easy sitting in the stands or armchair watching!

[NottsTastic]

It’s the defenders making mistakes that cost us, but a lot of it comes from the tactics and how we approach games. I don’t constantly blame the defenders for what happens and I can let it go. Aden Baldwin got a lot of criticism going into the Bromley game and when he made a mistake in the first half, people took to Twitter. Some of the same people praised him for his winning goal.

[CliftonMagpie]

We need to find ways to work with the existing players. Making bad choices doesn’t always mean they’ve lost focus. This is something I wish Luke Williams understood. He’s right about most things, but he keeps insisting it’s a lack of concentration when it’s more about not reacting well to pressure.

[liampie]

i think those people who are saying kyle cameron and aden baldwin are not good enough, are mistaken. it keeps being mentioned on social media, nobody is perfect at this level but one solid signing at the back could make a significant difference.